Save "Long Chains of Transmission ("He said that he said that he said...)"
Long Chains of Transmission ("He said that he said that he said...)
אמר רבי תנחום בריה דרבי חייא איש כפר עכו אמר רבי יעקב בר אחא אמר ר' שמלאי ואמרי לה אמר ר' תנחום אמר רב הונא ואמרי לה אמר רב הונא לחודיה
The Gemara returns to the halakhot of ostracism and mentions that Rabbi Tanḥum, son of Rabbi Ḥiyya, of the village of Akko, said that Rabbi Ya’akov bar Aḥa said that Rabbi Simlai said, and some say that this tradition was transmitted in the following manner: Rabbi Tanḥum said that Rav Huna said, and others say that Rav Huna himself made this statement without the chain of transmission:
כי הוה קא ניחא נפשיה אמר לה לדביתהו ידענא בדרבנן דרתיחי עלי ולא מיעסקי בי שפיר אוגנין בעיליתאי ולא תידחלין מינאי א"ר שמואל בר נחמני אישתעיא לי אימיה דרבי יונתן דאישתעיא לה דביתהו דרבי אלעזר ברבי שמעון לא פחות מתמני סרי ולא טפי מעשרין ותרין שנין אוגניתיה בעיליתא
As Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Shimon, was dying, he said to his wife: I know that the Rabbis are angry at me for arresting several thieves who are their relatives, and therefore they will not properly tend to my burial. When I die, lay me in my attic and do not be afraid of me, i.e., do not fear that anything will happen to my corpse. Rabbi Shmuel bar Naḥmani said: Rabbi Yonatan’s mother told me that the wife of Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Shimon, told her: I laid him in the attic for no less than eighteen years and for no more than twenty-two years.
אמר רבי חייא בריה דאבא בר נחמני אמר רב חסדא אמר רב ואמרי לה אמר רב חסדא אמר זעירי כל המוגמרות מברכין עליהן בורא עצי בשמים חוץ ממושק שמן חיה הוא שמברכין עליו בורא מיני בשמים
R. Hiyya b. Abba b. Nahmani stated that Rab Hisda said in the name of Rab (another version : Rab Hisda said in the name of Ze'iri) : Overall kinds of perfumes the benediction is "...Who Greatest fragrant woods," excepting musk which comes from a species of animal and its benediction is "...Who createst various kinds of spices."
ולמה ליה כולי האי דאמר רב יהודה אמר רב ואמרי לה אמר ר' חייא בר אבא אמר ר' יוחנן ואמרי לה אמר ר' שמואל בר נחמני אמר ר' יונתן כל המלמד את בן חבירו תורה זוכה ויושב בישיבה של מעלה שנאמר (ירמיהו טו, יט) אם תשוב ואשיבך לפני תעמוד
§ The Gemara asks: And why did Rabbi Yehuda HaNasi exert himself so much to save these wayward sons? The Gemara answers: It is because of that which Rav Yehuda says that Rav says, and some say that which Rabbi Ḥiyya bar Abba says that Rabbi Yoḥanan says, and some say that which Rabbi Shmuel bar Naḥmani says that Rabbi Yonatan says: Anyone who teaches Torah to the son of another merits to sit and study in the heavenly academy, as it is stated: “Therefore so says the Lord: If you return, and I bring you back, you shall stand before Me” (Jeremiah 15:19). This verse, which is addressed to Jeremiah, indicates that if he is able to cause the Jewish people to return to God, he himself will be brought to stand before God.
אמר רב נחמן אמר שמואל משום אבא שאול בן אימא מרים בין דלא שבועה בין דנקי שבועה בין דלא נדר ובין דנקי נדר בין מנכסי ובין מנכסיא אילין בין הוא ובין יורשיו אין משביעין אותה אבל מה אעשה שהרי אמרו חכמים הבא ליפרע מנכסי יתומים לא יפרע אלא בשבועה
Rav Naḥman said that Shmuel said in the name of Abba Shaul ben Imma Miriam: Whether he wrote: Not an oath, or whether he wrote: Clear from an oath, and whether he wrote: Not a vow, or whether he wrote: Clear from a vow, and whether he added: From my property, or whether he added: From these properties, neither he nor his heirs can administer an oath to her according to the letter of the law. However, what can I do, as the Sages said that one who comes to collect a debt from the property of orphans may collect it only by means of an oath? Therefore, she is compelled to take an oath in any case involving a claim from the orphans.
אמר רבא הלכתא פחות משלשה כלבוד דמי עשרה רשותא אחריתי היא משלשה עד עשרה היינו דבעא מיניה רב יוסף מרב הונא ולא פשט ליה אמר רב הלכה כרבי שמעון בן אלעזר וכן אמר באלי אמר רב יעקב ברה בת שמואל הלכה כרבי שמעון בן אלעזר ורבא אמר אין הלכה כרבי שמעון בן אלעזר
Rava summarized and said: The halakha is that less than three handbreadths is considered connected and it is permitted to recite Shema. Ten handbreadths is a separate domain. Three to ten handbreadths is the case with regard to which Rav Yosef raised a dilemma before Rav Huna, and Rav Huna did not resolve it for him. Rav said: The halakha is in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Shimon ben Elazar. And, so too, the Sage Bali said that Rav Ya’akov, son of Shmuel’s daughter, said: The halakha is in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Shimon ben Elazar. And Rava said: The halakha is not in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Shimon ben Elazar.
ושוב פעם אחת נמצאת הלטאה בבית המטבחים ובקשו לטמא כל הסעודה כולה באו ושאלו את המלך אמר להם לכו ושאלו את המלכה באו ושאלו את המלכה אמרה להם לכו ושאלו את רבן גמליאל
And another time there was a similar incident involving the king, queen, and Rabban Gamliel. It happened that a dead lizard was found in the kitchen of the royal house. Since a lizard is one of the creeping animals whose carcasses impart ritual impurity upon contact, they wanted to pronounce the entire meal ritually impure. They came and asked the king. He said to them: Go and ask the queen. They came and asked the queen. She said to them: Go and ask Rabban Gamliel to rule on the matter.
א"ר יצחק בר נחמני אמר שמואל הלכה כרבי יוסי בן כיפר שאמר משום ר"ש שזורי מתקיף לה רבי זירא ומי אמר שמואל הכי והאמר שמואל לכל אין בילה חוץ מיין ושמן
Rabbi Yitzḥak bar Naḥmani said that Shmuel said: The halakha is in accordance with the statement of Rabbi Yosei ben Keifar that he said in the name of Rabbi Shimon Shezuri. Rabbi Zeira strongly objects to this: And did Shmuel actually say this? But didn’t Shmuel say: There is no mixing for anything except for wine, oil, and other liquids? In the case of liquids he holds that everything is entirely mixed together, but not in the case of solids. How, then, could he have ruled in accordance with the opinion of Rabbi Shimon Shezuri?
רַב פָּפָּא אִיקְּלַע לְבֵי רַב הוּנָא בְּרֵיהּ דְּרַב אִיקָא. אַיְיתוֹ לְקַמַּיְיהוּ שֶׁמֶן וַהֲדַס. שְׁקַל רַב פָּפָּא בָּרֵיךְ אַהֲדַס בְּרֵישָׁא, וַהֲדַר בָּרֵיךְ אַשֶּׁמֶן. אָמַר לֵיהּ: לָא סָבַר לַהּ מָר הֲלָכָה כְּדִבְרֵי הַמַּכְרִיעַ? אָמַר לֵיהּ: הָכִי אָמַר רָבָא: הֲלָכָה כְּבֵית הִלֵּל. וְלָא הִיא, לְאִשְׁתְּמוֹטֵי נַפְשֵׁיהּ הוּא דַּעֲבַד.
The Gemara relates: Rav Pappa happened to come to the house of Rav Huna, son of Rav Ika. They brought before him both scented oil and a myrtle branch. Rav Pappa took and recited a blessing over the myrtle branch first and then recited a blessing over the oil. Rav Huna said to him: And does the Master not hold that the halakha is in accordance with the opinion of the decisor? If so, you should have recited a blessing over the oil first. Rav Pappa said: Rava said the following: The halakha is in accordance with the opinion of Beit Hillel. The Gemara comments: That is not so, as Rava did not issue that ruling. Rather, Rav Pappa did this in order to extricate himself from an unpleasant situation and justify his conduct.
וְאָמַר רָבָא בַּר מַחְסֵיָא אָמַר רַב חָמָא בַּר גּוּרְיָא אָמַר רַב: כׇּל עִיר שֶׁגַּגּוֹתֶיהָ גְּבוֹהִין מִבֵּית הַכְּנֶסֶת לְסוֹף חֲרֵבָה. שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״לְרוֹמֵם אֶת בֵּית אֱלֹהֵינוּ וּלְהַעֲמִיד אֶת חׇרְבוֹתָיו״. וְהָנֵי מִילֵּי בְּבָתִּים, אֲבָל בְּקִשְׁקוּשֵׁי וַאֲבַרְוָרֵי לֵית לַן בַּהּ. אָמַר רַב אָשֵׁי: אֲנָא עֲבַדִי לְמָתָא מַחְסֵיָא דְּלָא חֲרַבָה. וְהָא חֲרַבָה! מֵאוֹתוֹ עָוֹן לֹא חָרְבָה.
And Rava bar Meḥasseya said that Rav Ḥama bar Gurya said that Rav said: Any city whose roofs are higher than the synagogue will ultimately be destroyed because of the contempt shown the synagogue. Allusion to this is from that which is stated: “To uplift the house of our God and restore its ruins” (Ezra 9:9). The house that is devoted to God needs to be elevated above the other houses of the city. The Gemara adds: And this applies only to the height of the houses themselves. However, if the poles [kashkushei] and the towers [abrurei] that extend from the house are higher than the synagogue, we have no problem with it. Rav Ashi said: I caused the city of Mata Meḥasseya to not be destroyed by building the synagogue higher than the other houses. The Gemara asks: Wasn’t Mata Meḥasseya ultimately destroyed? The Gemara answers: It was not destroyed because of that sin; other sins caused its destruction.
אזל ר' אלעזר אמר לשמעתא בי מדרשא ולא אמרה משמיה דר' יוחנן שמע רבי יוחנן איקפד עול לגביה רבי אמי ור' אסי אמרו ליה לא כך היה המעשה בבית הכנסת של טבריא בנגר שיש בראשו גלוסטרא שנחלקו בו רבי אלעזר ורבי יוסי עד שקרעו ספר תורה בחמתן קרעו ס"ד אלא אימא שנקרע ס"ת בחמתן והיה שם רבי יוסי בן קיסמא אמר תמיה אני אם לא יהיה בית הכנסת זו עבודת כוכבים וכן הוה הדר איקפד טפי אמר חברותא נמי עול לגביה ר' יעקב בר אידי א"ל (יהושע יא, טו) כאשר צוה ה' את משה עבדו כן צוה משה את יהושע וכן עשה יהושע לא הסיר דבר מכל אשר צוה ה' את משה וכי על כל דבר שאמר יהושע היה אומר להם כך אמר לי משה אלא יהושע יושב ודורש סתם והכל יודעין שתורתו של משה היא אף ר' אלעזר תלמידך יושב ודורש סתם והכל יודעין כי שלך היא אמר להם מפני מה אי אתם יודעין לפייס כבן אידי חברינו ורבי יוחנן מ"ט קפיד כולי האי דאמר רב יהודה אמר רב מאי דכתיב (תהלים סא, ה) אגורה באהלך עולמים וכי אפשר לו לאדם לגור בשני עולמים אלא אמר דוד לפני הקדוש ברוך הוא רבונו של עולם יהי רצון שיאמרו דבר שמועה מפי בעוה"ז דאמר רבי יוחנן משום רבי שמעון בן יוחי כל ת"ח שאומרים דבר שמועה מפיו בעולם הזה שפתותיו דובבות בקבר אמר ר' יצחק בן זעירא ואיתימא שמעון נזירא מאי קראה (שיר השירים ז, י) וחכך כיין הטוב הולך לדודי למישרים דובב שפתי ישנים ככומר של ענבים מה כומר של ענבים כיון שמניח אדם אצבעו עליו מיד דובב אף תלמידי חכמים כיון שאומרים דבר שמועה מפיהם בעוה"ז שפתותיהם דובבות בקבר:
§ Rabbi Elazar went and said this halakha in the study hall, but he did not state it in the name of Rabbi Yoḥanan. Instead, he issued the halakha without attribution. Rabbi Yoḥanan heard that Rabbi Elazar omitted mention of his name and became angry with him. Rabbi Ami and Rabbi Asi visited Rabbi Yoḥanan, to placate him so that he would not be annoyed with his beloved disciple. They said to him: Wasn’t there an incident in the synagogue of Tiberias involving a bolt that secures a door in place and that has a thick knob [gelustera] at its end? The question was whether it may be moved on Shabbat as a vessel, or whether it is considered muktze as raw material. And it was stated that Rabbi Elazar and Rabbi Yosei argued over this case until they became so upset with each other that they tore a Torah scroll in their anger. The Gemara interrupts this account to clarify exactly what happened: Tore? Can it enter your mind that such great Sages would intentionally tear a Torah scroll? Rather, you must say that a Torah scroll was torn through their anger. In the heat of their debate they pulled the scroll from one side to another until it tore. And Rabbi Yosei ben Kisma, who was there at the time, said: I would be surprised if this synagogue does not become a place of idolatrous worship. This unfortunate event is a sign that this place is unsuitable for a synagogue. And indeed this eventually occurred. Rabbi Ami and Rabbi Asi cited this baraita to hint to Rabbi Yoḥanan how careful one must be to avoid anger. However, Rabbi Yoḥanan grew even angrier, saying: You are even making us colleagues now? Those two Sages were peers, whereas Rabbi Elazar is merely my student. Rabbi Ya’akov bar Idi visited Rabbi Yoḥanan and said to him: The verse states: “As God commanded His servant Moses, so did Moses command Joshua, and so did Joshua, he left nothing undone of all that the Lord commanded Moses” (Joshua 11:15). Now did Joshua, with regard to every matter that he said, say to the Jews: Thus Moses said to me? Rather, Joshua would sit and teach Torah without attributing his statements, and everyone would know that it was from the Torah of Moses. So too, your disciple Rabbi Elazar sits and teaches without attribution, and everyone knows that his teaching is from your instruction. Hearing this, Rabbi Yoḥanan was appeased. Later, after calming down, he said to Rabbi Ami and Rabbi Asi: Why don’t you know how to appease me like our colleague ben Idi? The Gemara asks: And Rabbi Yoḥanan, what is the reason that he was so angry about this matter? The Gemara answers that this is as Rav Yehuda said that Rav said: What is the meaning of that which is written: “I will dwell in Your tent in worlds” (Psalms 61:5), literally, forever? And is it possible for a person to live in two worlds simultaneously? Rather, David said before the Holy One, Blessed be He: Master of the Universe, let it be Your will that they will say a matter of halakha in my name in this world when I have passed on to another world. As Rabbi Yoḥanan said in the name of Rabbi Shimon ben Yoḥai: With regard to any Torah scholar in whose name a matter of halakha is said in this world, his lips mouth the words in the grave, as though he is talking. Rabbi Yitzḥak ben Ze’eira said, and some say this was stated by Shimon the Nazirite: What is the verse from which it is derived? “And the roof of your mouth is like the best wine that glides down smoothly for my beloved, moving gently the lips of those who are asleep” (Song of Songs 7:10). He explains: This is like a pile [komer] of grapes left to warm before they are pressed: Just as in the case of a pile of grapes, when a person places his finger on it, immediately it moves, as the wine bursts through and the whole pile shakes, so too with Torah scholars: When a teaching is said in their name in this world their lips mouth the words in the grave. For this reason Rabbi Yoḥanan wanted his Torah statements to be attributed to him, so that he would earn eternal life.
איני והא שלח ליה רבי יהודה נשיאה לרבי אמי הוו יודעין שכל ימיו של רבי יוחנן היה מלמדנו מאיימין על העדים על החדש שלא נראה בזמנו לקדשו אע"פ שלא ראוהו יאמרו ראינו
The Gemara asks: Is that so? But didn’t Rabbi Yehuda Nesia, who was the Nasi of the Sanhedrin, send a message to Rabbi Ami: Be aware that all the days of Rabbi Yoḥanan he would teach us that witnesses may be intimidated into giving testimony about the new moon that was not seen in its due time. This was done in order that the new month may be sanctified early, already on the thirtieth. Although the witnesses did not see the moon, they may say: We saw it.
אָמַר רַבָּה בַּר בַּר חָנָה אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי יְהוּדָה בְּרַבִּי אִלְעַאי: בֹּא וּרְאֵה שֶׁלֹּא כְּדוֹרוֹת הָרִאשׁוֹנִים דּוֹרוֹת הָאַחֲרוֹנִים. דּוֹרוֹת הָרִאשׁוֹנִים עָשׂוּ תּוֹרָתָן קֶבַע וּמְלַאכְתָּן עֲרַאי, זוֹ וָזוֹ נִתְקַיְּימָה בְּיָדָן. דּוֹרוֹת הָאַחֲרוֹנִים שֶׁעָשׂוּ מְלַאכְתָּן קֶבַע וְתוֹרָתָן עֲרַאי, זוֹ וָזוֹ לֹא נִתְקַיְּימָה בְּיָדָן. וְאָמַר רַבָּה בַּר בַּר חָנָה אָמַר רַבִּי יוֹחָנָן מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי יְהוּדָה בְּרַבִּי אִלְעַאי: בֹּא וּרְאֵה שֶׁלֹּא כְּדוֹרוֹת הָרִאשׁוֹנִים דּוֹרוֹת הָאַחֲרוֹנִים. דּוֹרוֹת הָרִאשׁוֹנִים הָיוּ מַכְנִיסִין פֵּירוֹתֵיהֶן דֶּרֶךְ טְרַקְסְמוֹן כְּדֵי לְחַיְּיבָן בְּמַעֲשֵׂר, דּוֹרוֹת הָאַחֲרוֹנִים מַכְנִיסִין פֵּירוֹתֵיהֶן דֶּרֶךְ גַּגּוֹת, דֶּרֶךְ חֲצֵרוֹת, דֶּרֶךְ קַרְפֵּיפוֹת, כְּדֵי לְפׇטְרָן מִן הַמַּעֲשֵׂר. דְּאָמַר רַבִּי יַנַּאי: אֵין הַטֶּבֶל מִתְחַיֵּיב בְּמַעֲשֵׂר עַד שֶׁיִּרְאֶה פְּנֵי הַבַּיִת, שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״בִּעַרְתִּי הַקֹּדֶשׁ מִן הַבַּיִת״.
Summarizing these statements, Rabba bar bar Ḥana said that Rabbi Yoḥanan said in the name of the tanna Rabbi Yehuda, son of Rabbi El’ai: Come and see that the latter generations are not like the earlier generations; rather they are their inferiors. The earlier generations made their Torah permanent and their work occasional, and this, Torah study, and that, their work, were successful for them. However, the latter generations who made their work permanent and their Torah occasional, neither this nor that was successful for them. Along these lines, Rabba bar bar Ḥana said that Rabbi Yoḥanan said in the name of Rabbi Yehuda, son of Rabbi El’ai: Come and see that the latter generations are not like the earlier generations. In the earlier generations, people would bring their fruits into their courtyards through the main gate in order to obligate them in tithes. However, the latter generations bring their fruits through roofs, through courtyards and through enclosed courtyards, avoiding the main gate in order to exempt them from the mitzva of tithing. As Rabbi Yannai said: Untithed produce is not obligated in the mitzva of tithing until it sees the front of the house through which people enter and exit, and it is brought into the house that way as it is stated in the formula of the confession of the tithes: “I have removed the consecrated from the house” (Deuteronomy 26:13), as the obligation to tithe produce whose purpose has not yet been designated takes effect only when it is brought into the house.
אמר רבי זירא אמר רבי אסי אמר רבי אלעזר אמר רבי חנינא אמר רב בצד עמוד זה התפלל רבי ישמעאל ברבי יוסי של שבת בערב שבת כי אתא עולא אמר בצד תמרה הוה ולא בצד עמוד הוה ולא רבי ישמעאל ברבי יוסי הוה אלא רבי אלעזר ברבי יוסי הוה ולא של שבת בערב שבת הוה אלא של מוצאי שבת בשבת הוה:

Rabbi Zeira said that Rabbi Asi said that Rabbi Elazar said that Rabbi Ḥanina said that Rav said: Alongside this specific pillar before me, Rabbi Yishmael, son of Rabbi Yosei, prayed the Shabbat prayer on the eve of Shabbat before nightfall.

But when Ulla came from the Eretz Yisrael to Babylonia, he related a different version of this story. He said that he had heard: This transpired beside a palm tree, not beside a pillar, and it was not Rabbi Yishmael, son of Rabbi Yosei, but it was Rabbi Elazar, son of Rabbi Yosei, and it was not the Shabbatprayer on Shabbat eve before nightfall, rather it was the prayer of the conclusion of Shabbat on Shabbat.

אָמַר רַבִּי בִּיזְנָא בַּר זַבְדָּא אָמַר רַבִּי עֲקִיבָא אָמַר רַבִּי פַּנְדָּא אָמַר רַב נַחוּם אָמַר רַבִּי בִּירִים מִשּׁוּם זָקֵן אֶחָד, וּמַנּוּ — רַבִּי בְּנָאָה: עֶשְׂרִים וְאַרְבָּעָה פּוֹתְרֵי חֲלוֹמוֹת הָיוּ בִּירוּשָׁלַיִם, פַּעַם אַחַת חָלַמְתִּי חֲלוֹם וְהָלַכְתִּי אֵצֶל כּוּלָּם, וּמַה שֶּׁפָּתַר לִי זֶה לֹא פָּתַר לִי זֶה, וְכוּלָּם נִתְקַיְּימוּ בִּי. לְקַיֵּים מַה שֶּׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״כׇּל הַחֲלוֹמוֹת הוֹלְכִים אַחַר הַפֶּה״.
In a long chain of those transmitting this statement, it is said that Rabbi Bizna bar Zavda said that Rabbi Akiva said that Rabbi Panda said that Rav Naḥum said that Rabbi Birayim said in the name of one elder, and who is he, Rabbi Bena’a: There were twenty-four interpreters of dreams in Jerusalem. One time, I dreamed a dream and went to each of them to interpret it. What one interpreted for me the other did not interpret for me, and, nevertheless, all of the interpretations were realized in me, to fulfill that which is stated: All dreams follow the mouth of the interpreter.
רַבִּי נַחְמָן בַּר שְׁמוּאֵל בַּר נַחְמָן בְּשֵׁם רַב שְׁמוּאֵל בַּר נַחְמָן אָמַר, הִנֵּה טוֹב מְאֹד, זֶה יֵצֶר טוֹב. וְהִנֵּה טוֹב מְאֹד, זֶה יֵצֶר רָע. וְכִי יֵצֶר הָרָע טוֹב מְאֹד, אֶתְמְהָא. אֶלָּא שֶׁאִלּוּלֵי יֵצֶר הָרָע לֹא בָּנָה אָדָם בַּיִת, וְלֹא נָשָׂא אִשָּׁה, וְלֹא הוֹלִיד, וְלֹא נָשָׂא וְנָתַן. וְכֵן שְׁלֹמֹה אוֹמֵר (קהלת ד, ד): כִּי הִיא קִנְאַת אִישׁ מֵרֵעֵהוּ.
Rabbi Nahman said in Rabbi Samuel's name: 'Behold, it was good' refers to the Good Desire; 'And behold, it was very good' refers to the Evil Desire. (It only says 'very good' after man was created with both the good and bad inclinations, in all other cases it only says 'and God saw that it was good') Can then the Evil Desire be very good? That would be extraordinary! But without the Evil Desire, however, no man would build a house, take a wife and beget children; and thus said Solomon: 'Again, I considered all labour and all excelling in work, that it is a man's rivalry with his neighbor.' (Ecclesiastes 4:4).
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